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The central issue to this reading is that the Melians are reluctant to give the Athenians rulership. This is their warning to other cities not to make the same mistake. In doing so, they are telling the Melians that if they do not come with them, there will be war. If they do fight in the war they lose an alliance who could greatly benefit them in the later future. I think that the Athenians were right in a sense because they gave a warning to the Melians that they would destroy them so surrender when you have the chance. The Athenians retaliate with a good point of their own. The Melian Dialogue is an example of the power that the Athenians had and their will to exploit it just to be better than everyone else. I believe Cleon is out of control. Diamond Davis on September 21, at pm said: The Melian Dialogue; which main argument centers around mercy, poses what is just for the enemy at hand. They have to pick the lesser of two evils: become overtaken and risk becoming Athenian slaves, or resist the invasion and therefore start a war. Briana Kraml on September 21, at pm said: I chose to write about the Melian Dialogue, which is a debate or argument between the Athenians and the Melians. If there was any chance of the Melians to win then they should have kept trying to make peace, but in reality there was no way for them to win so they should have just surrender and make life easier for all the people. It came out to be fatal for them. The main focus of this argument is that the Athenians want to take rule over the Melians, yet the Melians are devoted to the Spartans. At one point they argue Athens that Sparta will come to their aid, to which Athens rebuttals that they are not important enough to waste the resources defending. It would not be profitable and would add another enemy to the state rather than an ally who could assist Athens in fighting other foes ex. This shows that the Athenians will not compromise and that they will destroy the Melians if they do not cooperate. Diodotus and Cleon; two power figures battle through debate on what should be done. They decided that it would be a good idea for them to kill and thats exactly what they did. Sean Bowman on September 21, at pm said: The Melian Dialogue opens with a surprisingly civil discussion between the Melian commissioners and the Athenian Envoy or at least it seems so at face value. Our confidence, therefore, after all is not so utterly irrational. He does not want to give the enemy any pity, fairness, and especially forgiveness. I think more cities would want to be allies with the Athens in fear for their lives. Later on the Melians decide they should become neutral. On the other hand, they would have to put up a fight against a much larger, more formidable army that there is no chance of winning against. Wanting to kill off an entire city is a horrible thing to do. On one hand, they could have been safe and just joined the Athenian side, but that would have cost them their allegiance to Sparta, which could end up being a problem in the future. For we see that you are come to be judges of the conference, and that the issue of it, if we be superior in argument and therefore yield not, is likely to bring us war, and if we yield, servitude. Bookmark the permalink. No matter what choice they made they were going to end up in war or dead. This is because the Melians wanted peace and tried to convince the Athenians to act with morality instead of being inhumane and worrying just about their own reputation. In section 3. The Athenians were not really smart in their decisions. The Athenians slaughter all the male subjects of Melos, enslave the women and children, and overtake the island. But we trust that the gods may grant us fortune as good as yours, since we are just men fighting against unjust, and that what we want in power will be made up by the alliance of the Lacedaemonians, who are bound, if only for very shame, to come to the aid of their kindred. Diodotus basically tries to make their audience empathize by turning the tables around. In turn, what do YOU think about the situation and their rationale, and why? In a sense, they are both justified in their beliefs. The Melians have been put in a tight position by the Athenians, and there is no straight-cut correct way they could have handled their situation. This argument or debate is between the two rivals Melians and the Athenians. However, realistically I see Diodotus having the better argument. They killed all the men and they enslaved all of their wives and children. Rosa Aives on September 21, at pm said: I have chosen to write about the Melian Dialogue. The Melians wanted an alliance except the Athenians did not want their reputation ruined. And first tell us if this proposition of ours suits you. The Melians should have used common sense because they should have known that all the Athenians wanted was to rule and that they were not going to stop until they reach that goal. After all the debating the Athenians chose to ally themselves with Greece. And in section 3. I feel that the Athenians are only putting the time and effort into ruling over the Melians because they simply can. Diodotus is more logical and ethical, choosing to take pity and acknowledge the consequences of attacking. Despite this, Cleon insists that because they conspired against Athens, they must make an example of them. In these well-known set-pieces, Thucydides provides a fascinating exploration of key issues and concerns related to war and peace, such as justice, mercy, authority, violence, hate, negotiation, and surrender etc. Tough luck for the Melians to be put into such a situation like this. The theme that this part falls under would be war and peace.

Given his personal experiences during the Peloponnesian War, there is no doubt that Thucydides knew well the realities of battle, and that read more help to explain the remarkable vividness of his writing.

The Athenians argue that the Melians should accept their rule rather https://1-veda.ru/paypal/paypal-rabbit-line-pay.html go to war.

They make it clear that if there are certain conditions that are disagreed on, the Melians are encouraged to stop the discussion and fix the issue right there before proceeding. Alex Clarkson on September 21, at am said: I have chosen to write about the Melian Dialogue.

In a race to expand territory against the Spartans, they are taking the Melians only for the land. The Athenians say that by falling under their rulership the Melians will be saving themselves from war. He wants them to have compassion for their opponent because they would have desired the same, if they were kneeling before those who had the ability to comment payer au magasin avec paypal their life immediately.

By this point in the argument the Athenians are tired of the Melians fight for peace, and have resulted to threatening them in order to get them to comply. It is a rather harsh and inhumane act, but it is like a lesson to everyone else.

This is not a good decision. A war which they will lose. The Melian Dialogue is an argument between the Melians and the Athenians. He also argues that taking pity and being lenient are disadvantageous to the empire. Wherein with the best success we recover but an exhausted city and lose that wherein our strength lieth, the comment payer au magasin avec paypal of it; but miscarrying, we add these enemies to our former and must spend that time in warring against our own confederates, which we needed to employ against the enemies we have already.

It would be wise to comment payer au magasin avec paypal your people alive and fall under different rulership, rather than go to war, lose part of your army and still have the possibility of falling under different rulership.

The Athenians were very cruel. Cleon is extremely violent and sees no mercy, while on the other hand Diodotus feels there should be mercy.

I agree with Diodotus and his standpoint on what actions should be done because though there are not in their predicament, they could of have been.

That the Athenians still have a chance to win the war overall. Diodotus claims, that he is not arguing for pity or fairness, but just for the fate of the Athens. The Athenians present the Melian representatives with an ultimatum phrased in a very respectable and practical way it appears. I see where Cleon is coming from with abolishing their entire population because they were their own city and they honored their laws, yet they revolted against the Athens. I think that being neutral really hurt them. This text is a debate between Athenians and Melians about going to war because the Athenians want to take rulership over the Melians. They are saying that if they give Athenians rulership, what do they receive in return. The Athenians are giving the Melians an option: come with us and be safe, or die. The rest that were left besieged the place. The Athenians told the Melians to accept their rule and life would be easier, but since they did not war would soon happen. The Melians, in the end, decide to remain neutral, which is a fatal decision for them. In Thucydides 5. If they were smart they would realize that their chances of defeating and getting power were slim to none. He states that acting out hastily especially in anger is the worst thing the Athens can do. I believe that the Melians are stuck in a situation that will not end well for them either way. After their killing spree they took over and invaded the island. I believe that the Athenians have made a better point than the Melians, because although Melians will not be in charge anymore, they will be keeping their people alive and avoiding battle with the Athenians. It seems the Athenians are only giving the illusion of cooperation, when they already have their minds made up as to what they are going to do. In this debate, they are arguing about war. What is to say they will be important enough for Athens to defend later? Cleon is more authoritative, believing that the Mytilenaeans can be a threat to the empire and they must act to continue their dominion. Wiping out an entire city-state would be costly and ultimately wrong. What kind of image would that give the Athens if they go on a killing spree? So, they could ultimately be protecting themselves in the war. The Athenians did this just to protect their reputation even though the Melians were trying to get them to realize that there was a better way of going about it. The Melians bring up a good point about not getting anything in return for this deal that the Athenians propose to them. In your response, I would like you to negotiate one specific aspect or theme of the debate, and do so by quoting and discussing particular statements made by speakers in these sections.